Barbless Hooks?

[NGA_Greg]

In most ways, yesterday was one of the best days of fishing I've had in a while. I hooked 7-8 browns with an EHC and to make it even better, I was using an EHC I tied myself which was a first for me. Now for the problem. I didn't land any of them. You see, I ground the barb off the hook on this EHC because I wanted to give barbless hooks a try. Now in every case, I hooked the fish and in most cases played him pretty close to landing him and at the last second, he would do a head shake and get off. I kept my line tight, but it just didn't help. What am I doing wrong? By the way, if you say that what I'm doing wrong is using a barbless hook in the first place, I would consider that a valid responce. If I can make barbless hook work for me, I'd like to use them because I always seem to have a hard time releasing fish I catch with a barbed hook and because of the way they pull right out of your skin.

Thanks,
Greg

[BLACK KNIGHT]

Just a little moral support being thrown your way- I've been there too. Matter of fact, hooked up and lost 3x as many we caught at Nacoochee Bend in my first full scale barbless adventure. Some people say it doesn't matter, but I'm skeptical. I guess I haven't learned the Zen of barbless yet. But it does beat having to fish all day with a fly in your hand and going by the doctor to get a shot of lidecaine just so you can stand pushing it through (I'm a wimp). Don't ask how I know this.

[NGA_Greg]

BK - you reminded me of something. I have fished Nacoochee bend twice and used barbless there, but I had forgotten all about it. Both times we used barbless nypmhs and I don't recall losing any fish there. Are barbless nymphs possibly easier to land fish on than barbless dry flies? That would make sense in a way since fish I catch on a dry tend to tailwalk more. By the way, the EHC I was using was a 14 so I don't think this is the kind of problem that one would have with a small hook.

[RoyC]

All of my larger flies have been barbless for 4 years or more and many of the dries I have been tying in the last couple of years are since I started buying barbless dry fly hooks. I have a LDR rate of less than 2% (estimate of course)with all hooks and during the winter months when nymphs and woolybuggers are the staple I have not noticed the rate to increase.

I many cases (IMHO) the fly is thrown when the fish gets leverage against the took which pulls it free of the fish. With light dry flies the mass of the fly is so slight that if slack is not given to the fish the fly stays put. And slack is put in the fly line by the fish whipping its head from side to side. Even if you have a tight line, the head movement impacts slack for very shot periods of time. Keeping the rod tip high, as you bring a fish near to the net seems to help, the leader is nearly verticle to the fish and as the fish whips its head from side to side the fly line will not have any slack since it also is moving from side to side rather than being pulled towards the fish and then being pulled towards the angler.


Just may humble opinion...
RoyC

[BLACK KNIGHT]

Makes sense.

Oh, gosh, what have we done? I sense a new
barbed v barbless rumble coming on. That makes the Crips v. Bloods look like a church social! Good thing Owlie took the weekend off. Maybe we cn get this thread deleted before he gets back. http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/wink.gif

[REDTOP]

I lost 5 at JB yesterday,all but one on #18 ECH Barbless.I want to do the right thing ; but I'd like to put my hands on them.Also; I had tension on the line when the long distant releases happened. The other fish lost was on a #16 humpy Barbless.

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DAVE

[Castaway]

Give those barbless hooks a few trial runs. You may get the hang of it, if you don't just go back to barbs. It is easier to release fish with barbless so of course it is easier to loose them to. Just remember a long range release is better than no release, you could have been at work.

[fly on the wall]

A lot of folks out there just don't set the hook as hard when fishing dry flies as they would when nymphing.
Here's a few pointers:
1)Always use the heaviest tippet you can when fishing dries. I tie my one leaders based on George Harvey's model. This leader lays out so well that I rarely use less than 5X.
2) As a fish hits a floating fly in takes in water and air. This can act like a cushion. Allow a slight hesitation before setting the hook. You'll get better hook ups. The hook will set better as fish dives back down.
3) Use a steady upward pull when striking a fish versus a quick snap. Dry flies are typically smaller than nymphs and have less hook gap. This can result in less "bite". If the fly is near the hard edge of fish's mouth the hook point may be the only part that sticks. This is the typical case of the fly falling out of the fishes mouth when you land it. The steady pull hook set allows the hook to find a place to set.

[huntfish]

You're right about keeping a tight line; however, your rod angle may be wrong. Try keeping the rod opposite of the fish so the line goes over the back of the fish. That way when it does the head shake there will still be tension. If you are pulling the rod towards the front of the fish, when it head shakes, you are actually pulling the fly out.

IMHO

[tomlaub]

Huntfish is on it as usual http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif That's about the just about best way I've heard it put. Think about it like pulling it backwards against the pull of the fish. I've always thought about it as keeping the rod high with an extended arm so that the rod/line/hook angle is keeping the pressure upward so that the hook stays set. The hard part is when they are a great distance where the angle is much less. Then the high arm extension is even more important until you can get 'em turned to get the line posture HF suggests.....IMHumble-rO

[NGA_Greg]

I think you guys are trying to pass along a very valuable tip here, but I don't quite get it. Maybe one of you can show me what your talking about at the fling. Does everyone wear name tags or something at these events?

[huntfish]

NGA Greg
Will see you at the fling.

[KB]

Also, don't forget to keep your hooks sharp. If your like me, you often find yourself hooked into a tree or on the bottom. That can definatly dull you hook. You might be suprised by how many more fish you land simply by sharpening you hook.

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KB

* >`{{~< (http://www.creekcaster.com)

[oyster]

Greg,

I've fished both barbed and barbless hooks in a pseudo-objective manor and after years of experimenting I have come to this conclusion. Sometimes they just get away. I found the culprit more often than not to be from wimpy hook sets or sets that just didn't connect in the right place to start with. I have LDR'd alot of fish with barbless hooks, I used to LDR just as many with barbed hooks. That said, I now only use barbless from the smallest trout to the largest saltwater fish. I know I have released more fish that will live and at least I've got something to blame other than myself if they get away!

Bill

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Oyster Fine Bamboo Fly Rods

[tomlaub]

Good point http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif Oyster!!

I keep a very small diamond file (got it at the Fish Hawk) on my vest and use it often. I'd also add that if you've used your fly previously, the hook will have oxidized and will need to be resharpened...this is something I forget to do all the time!!

[Flashback]

Ditto, " some just get away."

Barbed or barbless, you can't land them all. The best laid traps of mice and men often fail to trap.

Don't worry too much about landing fish on any given day, just keep hooking them and more than a few will eventually come to the net. It just makes those that do sweeter.

[This message has been edited by Flashback (edited 04-23-2001).]

[The Owl]

http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif

You guys debate it til the cows come home, go get in their jammies, and drift off to moo-moo land.
Barbless vs. Barbed is a moot point. http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/wink.gif

Besides, if your busy watching the angle of your rod, or trying to keep a tight line all the time, when do you ever get to watch that 14 incher squirt out of the water and do his little trouty-jig? http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/wink.gif

I fish to catch fish, not to watch them throw the hook, and say "oh well". After all, I can't count their spots if I don't get them in close. http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif


To each his own, friends, to each his own.

Barbed Owl http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif



[This message has been edited by The Owl (edited 04-25-2001).]

[huntfish]

Fire in the Hole!!! http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/wink.gif The cow has pajamas and is singing a melody. http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif

[REDTOP]

Hey;Owl I'm probably going to try one more time barbless;BUT,I won't endure many more days like last thurs again.I like to catch fish and I like to eat fish.I never keep more than 2 or 3 ;but you can't keep what you can't touch.Besides;how do I Know one of those ldr's wasn't one of those elusive JB brookies?

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DAVE

[The Owl]

ooooooohhhhhh......that's right Dave. Didn't even think about that......you coulda had ole speckled-puss on there and not even knew'd dit ! http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif

I think I heard the ole hefer singing, " Fly like an eagle,.....into the future........". http://www.georgia-outdoors.com/ubbngto/smile.gif

[Tom]

Started to throw my two cents in here but then thought....ahh forget it. Excuse the post. Tight Lines, Tom