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Old 01-21-18, 09:30 PM   #21
I_got_skunked
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Originally Posted by fishnpreacher View Post
The locals sit in their trucks and wait on the stocking truck to come by, hop out, catch a limit, and leave.

Most do, some put a limit in the truck, wait a little, go catch another limit. I used to get my boxers in a bunch by this, but I soon realized that it's gonna happen. I would rather keep the few wild streams that I have fished off the grid as much as possible. There have been a few mentioned on here lately that I would rather not see openly listed, but they are in Jacob's books, so its not like they are top secret.
Wildcat is a grocery store fish market.....
While I do appreciate that there are many people out there who enjoy this aspect of our fisheries management, I do wonder if there are more effective ways of utilizing the hatcheries with a more long term focus.
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Old 01-22-18, 12:36 AM   #22
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While I do appreciate that there are many people out there who enjoy this aspect of our fisheries management, I do wonder if there are more effective ways of utilizing the hatcheries with a more long term focus.
Unfortunately stocking trout is not a long term proposition. If somebody doesn't catch the fish and keep them, studies have shown that most of them will die in a month or so

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Old 01-22-18, 07:06 AM   #23
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Unfortunately stocking trout is not a long term proposition. If somebody doesn't catch the fish and keep them, studies have shown that most of them will die in a month or so

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Stocking fingerlings that are illegal to take has proven successful in other states. High mortality rate, sure, but lower than the mortality rate of adult fish dropped into a single hole that might as well be the buckets of lawn chair bait chuckers. With a couple of exceptions, though, we do tend to stock only streams that wouldn't sustain a wild population so then it's a question of whether that is a useful endeavor at all. I'd like to see a lot more of the special regulation streams, though, because those work in my limited experience.
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Old 01-25-18, 12:25 PM   #24
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Great read. Wildcat is definitely a “put and take” stream that Fishinbub has aluded to in his previous post. There are several “wild” streams which are a more sensitive fishery. They would be harmed from public naming and discussion...

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Old 01-25-18, 03:45 PM   #25
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I have a pretty hard and fast rule on reporting posts. If it's stocked, or mentioned by name in the DNR regs book, it slides. There are a few exceptions, but not many.

No matter how you slice it, Wildcat (in Rabun) is 100% fair game IMHO. Other than Rock Creek, it's about as close as you can get to fishing in the hatchery. It's literally a mile down the street. The locals sit in their trucks and wait on the stocking truck to come by, hop out, catch a limit, and leave.
You talking about me?
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Old 01-25-18, 07:39 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by I_got_skunked View Post
Stocking fingerlings that are illegal to take has proven successful in other states. High mortality rate, sure, but lower than the mortality rate of adult fish dropped into a single hole that might as well be the buckets of lawn chair bait chuckers. With a couple of exceptions, though, we do tend to stock only streams that wouldn't sustain a wild population so then it's a question of whether that is a useful endeavor at all. I'd like to see a lot more of the special regulation streams, though, because those work in my limited experience.
I disagree. There aren't "a couple of exceptions".I Theate and USFS hatcheries stock loads and loads of wild trout streams that support trout year round. Many, many, many streams are neither strictly wild fish or stocked fish, but support both. Stocked fish are a little less wary, and get often get caught very quickly right off the bat. Some wise up, but few do. Those same creeks will still have wild trout in them year round once the stockers are plucked out. I'm thinking of most of the WMA streams that are stocked up here. Nearly ALL of them support wild trout year round.
Stocking those marginal streams isn't a fruitless endeavor. It provides additional fishing opportunities to a broader spectrum of people. Think, for instance, about a disabled or elderly person, or very young children. Many of them aren't able to hike into wilder streams, and stocked streams with easy access provide them sporting opportunities where they otherwise might not have them. It's a joy and time outdoors they otherwise might not have.
If we stopped stocking those marginal streams, many of which provide easy or roadside access, and only focused on wild ones, we could possibly be omitting or needlessly hampering a demographic, and catering to others, and that's somewhat contradictory to our Multiple Use, Sustained Yield policy for the Chattahoochee NF.
Those stockers also help keep a lot of people off the small or wild streams. They provide larger, easy to catch fish, so many choose not to go bushwhacking the small streams because the fish are generally small and difficult. Think about if they stopped stocking marginal streams. Lots of those people would then be fishing your facorite blue lines.
The majority of our wild streams are relatively healthy and thriving, and I can't see the benefit of stocking fingerlings. They simply are supporting themselves as is. I can indeed see where some streams could benefit from Habitat enhancement however.
I think that referring to some people as "lawn chair bait chuckers" is a derogatory remark. I'm thinking of someone's small child or grandfather with bad knees. If they want to sit by the bridge in a chair and catch some stockers, they should be able to. I came across a grandfather with his two grandchildren fishing from lawn chairs a few weeks back, and I thought it was a wonderfully sweet sight to see.
Sure there will be others to take advantage. That's the world we live in. But not all bait chuckers are EBT swindling, trout starved locals like folks often tend to imagine. Some just want to have fun, like you, and their zebco and trout worm is the way they choose.
Stockers are put there for the take, and it is for a reason. For people that want to catch stockers and keep them to eat, as I often do, let them. People shouldn't get bent out of shape about it, but rather head further in and further up and chase wilder fish which are warier, and prettier, and who survive wonderfully year round with no additional regulations or maintenance.

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Old 01-25-18, 09:11 PM   #27
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You talking about me?
But thatís a great strategy!
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Old 01-26-18, 07:31 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Killer Kyle View Post
I disagree. There aren't "a couple of exceptions".I Theate and USFS hatcheries stock loads and loads of wild trout streams that support trout year round. Many, many, many streams are neither strictly wild fish or stocked fish, but support both. Stocked fish are a little less wary, and get often get caught very quickly right off the bat. Some wise up, but few do. Those same creeks will still have wild trout in them year round once the stockers are plucked out. I'm thinking of most of the WMA streams that are stocked up here. Nearly ALL of them support wild trout year round.
Stocking those marginal streams isn't a fruitless endeavor. It provides additional fishing opportunities to a broader spectrum of people. Think, for instance, about a disabled or elderly person, or very young children. Many of them aren't able to hike into wilder streams, and stocked streams with easy access provide them sporting opportunities where they otherwise might not have them. It's a joy and time outdoors they otherwise might not have.
If we stopped stocking those marginal streams, many of which provide easy or roadside access, and only focused on wild ones, we could possibly be omitting or needlessly hampering a demographic, and catering to others, and that's somewhat contradictory to our Multiple Use, Sustained Yield policy for the Chattahoochee NF.
Those stockers also help keep a lot of people off the small or wild streams. They provide larger, easy to catch fish, so many choose not to go bushwhacking the small streams because the fish are generally small and difficult. Think about if they stopped stocking marginal streams. Lots of those people would then be fishing your facorite blue lines.
The majority of our wild streams are relatively healthy and thriving, and I can't see the benefit of stocking fingerlings. They simply are supporting themselves as is. I can indeed see where some streams could benefit from Habitat enhancement however.
I think that referring to some people as "lawn chair bait chuckers" is a derogatory remark. I'm thinking of someone's small child or grandfather with bad knees. If they want to sit by the bridge in a chair and catch some stockers, they should be able to. I came across a grandfather with his two grandchildren fishing from lawn chairs a few weeks back, and I thought it was a wonderfully sweet sight to see.
Sure there will be others to take advantage. That's the world we live in. But not all bait chuckers are EBT swindling, trout starved locals like folks often tend to imagine. Some just want to have fun, like you, and their zebco and trout worm is the way they choose.
Stockers are put there for the take, and it is for a reason. For people that want to catch stockers and keep them to eat, as I often do, let them. People shouldn't get bent out of shape about it, but rather head further in and further up and chase wilder fish which are warier, and prettier, and who survive wonderfully year round with no additional regulations or maintenance.
Ah yes, the locals lined up for the stocking truck are there for a form of recreation, I suppose. If I sound derogatory, it's because I don't respect it as sporting. It's a way to fill a cooler which, in its current form, amounts to a handout. What I would like to see is a program that improves the streams and dumping a bunch of stockers into a put and take hole does nothing to improve the stream. If our would trout populations are healthy, why dump stockers on top? Whether what I've suggested is better is debatable and there's certainly other ways, but our current system isn't geared or aimed towards doing it. Zebcos catch brim and bass just fine. Those grow to cooler size just fine without artificial stocking.
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Old 01-26-18, 04:47 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Killer Kyle View Post
I disagree. There aren't "a couple of exceptions".I Theate and USFS hatcheries stock loads and loads of wild trout streams that support trout year round. Many, many, many streams are neither strictly wild fish or stocked fish, but support both. Stocked fish are a little less wary, and get often get caught very quickly right off the bat. Some wise up, but few do. Those same creeks will still have wild trout in them year round once the stockers are plucked out. I'm thinking of most of the WMA streams that are stocked up here. Nearly ALL of them support wild trout year round.
Stocking those marginal streams isn't a fruitless endeavor. It provides additional fishing opportunities to a broader spectrum of people. Think, for instance, about a disabled or elderly person, or very young children. Many of them aren't able to hike into wilder streams, and stocked streams with easy access provide them sporting opportunities where they otherwise might not have them. It's a joy and time outdoors they otherwise might not have.
If we stopped stocking those marginal streams, many of which provide easy or roadside access, and only focused on wild ones, we could possibly be omitting or needlessly hampering a demographic, and catering to others, and that's somewhat contradictory to our Multiple Use, Sustained Yield policy for the Chattahoochee NF.
Those stockers also help keep a lot of people off the small or wild streams. They provide larger, easy to catch fish, so many choose not to go bushwhacking the small streams because the fish are generally small and difficult. Think about if they stopped stocking marginal streams. Lots of those people would then be fishing your facorite blue lines.
The majority of our wild streams are relatively healthy and thriving, and I can't see the benefit of stocking fingerlings. They simply are supporting themselves as is. I can indeed see where some streams could benefit from Habitat enhancement however.
I think that referring to some people as "lawn chair bait chuckers" is a derogatory remark. I'm thinking of someone's small child or grandfather with bad knees. If they want to sit by the bridge in a chair and catch some stockers, they should be able to. I came across a grandfather with his two grandchildren fishing from lawn chairs a few weeks back, and I thought it was a wonderfully sweet sight to see.
Sure there will be others to take advantage. That's the world we live in. But not all bait chuckers are EBT swindling, trout starved locals like folks often tend to imagine. Some just want to have fun, like you, and their zebco and trout worm is the way they choose.
Stockers are put there for the take, and it is for a reason. For people that want to catch stockers and keep them to eat, as I often do, let them. People shouldn't get bent out of shape about it, but rather head further in and further up and chase wilder fish which are warier, and prettier, and who survive wonderfully year round with no additional regulations or maintenance.
Well said - especially the CS Lewis reference further up and further in.

Public lands face pressures from lots of different sides and angles, and need as broad a constituency as can be offered without compromising or destroying the lands. This is one of the oldest questions that faces public lands, and the answers range from Edward Abbey in Desert Solitaire monkey-wrenching the road-graders to prevent motorized vehicle access, to the 60,000 people per day in October creeping bumper to bumper down to Cades Cove.

The different extremes and everything in between have degrees of validity - I don't know that we can find the balance in any way other than teaching people to respect the land. Personally, I don't expect to trout fish near a road or easy parking - that's for the people Kyle cites (grandparents, kids, bad knees or hips, etc). I'm healthy still and can walk a few miles if I want to be alone.

Sometimes it means I can't really do what I want to do - like hike to the Jacks river falls in summer because it means dodging people pushing beer coolers down the trail - but that's how it goes. Its a big wilderness and I'll find somewhere quiet - thats on me. Those people who use the wilderness differently than I do are constituents, and so long as they aren't destructive, carry on.

Finally, I typically carry an empty trash bag and haul out garbage that I find on my way out and down. Most places its pretty light but I have filled the bag to capacity at Ravens Cliff and Blood Mountain before. Good discussion and I enjoy reading what other people think - I ponder this question a lot while out there.

Enjoy your weekends!
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Old 01-26-18, 06:47 PM   #30
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Well said - especially the CS Lewis reference further up and further in.

Public lands face pressures from lots of different sides and angles, and need as broad a constituency as can be offered without compromising or destroying the lands. This is one of the oldest questions that faces public lands, and the answers range from Edward Abbey in Desert Solitaire monkey-wrenching the road-graders to prevent motorized vehicle access, to the 60,000 people per day in October creeping bumper to bumper down to Cades Cove.

The different extremes and everything in between have degrees of validity - I don't know that we can find the balance in any way other than teaching people to respect the land. Personally, I don't expect to trout fish near a road or easy parking - that's for the people Kyle cites (grandparents, kids, bad knees or hips, etc). I'm healthy still and can walk a few miles if I want to be alone.

Sometimes it means I can't really do what I want to do - like hike to the Jacks river falls in summer because it means dodging people pushing beer coolers down the trail - but that's how it goes. Its a big wilderness and I'll find somewhere quiet - thats on me. Those people who use the wilderness differently than I do are constituents, and so long as they aren't destructive, carry on.

Finally, I typically carry an empty trash bag and haul out garbage that I find on my way out and down. Most places its pretty light but I have filled the bag to capacity at Ravens Cliff and Blood Mountain before. Good discussion and I enjoy reading what other people think - I ponder this question a lot while out there.

Enjoy your weekends!
I'm impressed someone here so quickly caught the Lewis reference! I didn't bother putting it in quotations because I figured nobody would notice. As a small side hobby, I collect vintage books, usually first prints if I can find them at a reasonable price, and C.S. Lewis books are probably my favorite to collect. I'm delighted you caught that mudrun! Much respect!!
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